we need more users
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Oh hey, it's worth noting that that particular screengrab is taken out of context and was deliberately intended to make me appear that way. I even concede that one can disagree with Marx and Engels, my point was more against those who claim to agree with them but strongly disagree with the socialist market economy of China. I oppose anyone that tries to treat theory like gospel, that's why I usually don't reference theory directly unless it's directly relevent like it was in this case.
That's the thing, people propagandize about us as well, like the MeanwhileOnGrad crowd that took that snippet out of context. You're doing the same here, by extrapolating an entire behavior of me from a single, out-of-context snippet hosted in a Nazi bar. What's important is that we actually pay attention to what others are saying, because everyone is guilty of thinking they are correct.
But you are a tankie, cowbee. Why do you keep denying this?
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Fair enough. Just grabbed one of the first images a search threw. Sorry if it was out of context or portrayed you unfairly. And of course people propagandize about you too. Anyone with a strong enough voice will get bad faith critiques thrown against them and many will be with political intent.
I do think this is a fair example to exemplify the point I was trying to make, though. Your quote being out of context does not nullify its dychotomical political intent and makes my point stronger.
Propaganda is hard to identify when you're predisposed to believe it, it's everywhere and people propagate it without even noticing.
Don't let Cowbee propagandise you, that's what he's known for, even Tankies celebrate him for it.
He doesn't argue in good faith, either, don't believe such nonsense. Just have a look at all the other community posts about his extremism, bigotry and hatred. He's a Tankie full and through and one of the major reasons why Lemmy is destined to fail.
For example, I humbly ask you to challenge Cowbee on his views of North Korea and Putin. You'll find he is openly supportive of both.
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Posted as a reply because this will certainly upset many but...
On the instance wars:
I constantly see nonsense about the horrors of the '.ML' instance, and 'hexbear', primarily from 'Lemmy.world' users, but I have never once actually come across these horrors.
Hexbear is just a troll instance, ala 'cumtown'.
To an outside observer, '.world' users seem to be US propagandists intent on wrecking the platform. "Tankies this, cowbee that", when I've never seen a cowbee post that wasn't entirely reasonable.
And the vast majority of 'tankies' are just people who criticise the US rightfully while not sharing the same breathe to criticize China.
Ngl, fuck Russia, the US and Russia are the greatest evils. China is not anywhere near the same level. You can praise elements of a foreign state without being a 'tankie'.It's the same thought terminating cliche cult bullshit that all right wingers do. And it seems to come from Americans being upset their myopic views aren't babied by people who literally specifically went to an instance to avoid them?
Idk I'm not a user of any of the three, but I've only ever had an issue with lemmy.world users in the past, as a UK citizen who is far from a tankie.
Explodingheads was also self-proclaimed a troll instance. Just because they fall back on 'It's just a joke!" doesn't make what they say or do okay.
I recommend you check out !meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works for a deep look at Tankies and how prevalent they are throughout Lemmy.
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Don't let Cowbee propagandise you, that's what he's known for, even Tankies celebrate him for it.
He doesn't argue in good faith, either, don't believe such nonsense. Just have a look at all the other community posts about his extremism, bigotry and hatred. He's a Tankie full and through and one of the major reasons why Lemmy is destined to fail.
For example, I humbly ask you to challenge Cowbee on his views of North Korea and Putin. You'll find he is openly supportive of both.
I know @Cowbee@lemmy.ml doesn't argue in good faith. You're not arguing in good faith either. If you wanna internet argument fight the dude, I just pinged him for you, but before you do I suggest both of you consider the words of mustache man: "Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not himself become a monster."
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I know @Cowbee@lemmy.ml doesn't argue in good faith. You're not arguing in good faith either. If you wanna internet argument fight the dude, I just pinged him for you, but before you do I suggest both of you consider the words of mustache man: "Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not himself become a monster."
Honestly I don't think there's such a thing as good faith when it comes to political discussions on the internet. I'm not going to argue with him either, I don't consider it worthy of my time.
What's good faith to you? To me, it's admitting mistakes.
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Honestly I don't think there's such a thing as good faith when it comes to political discussions on the internet. I'm not going to argue with him either, I don't consider it worthy of my time.
What's good faith to you? To me, it's admitting mistakes.
To me, good faith is the genuine will to understand and/or convey ideas fairly and honestly.
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To me, good faith is the genuine will to understand and/or convey ideas fairly and honestly.
I agree, but I don't think fairness or honesty really exists anymore. Or rather, there's no incentive for people to engage in such.
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Now that you point it out, I think that's exactly it. I'm glad people like you are still around there.
according to the new users I'm an ignorant fascist hateful bigot nazi, etc. because I'm not going around being angry and making every issue into a binary choice of good vs evil.
woohoo! but yeah there are still plenty of good faith smart people who articulate subtle, empathic, and thoughtful commentary.
what sucks is watching those comments get removed by idiot mods because they don't fit the narrative of good vs evil. asklemmy was really dope until about two months ago. I got banned in a thread about trans issues, for having an opinion that individual athletic orgs should get to determine what they qualify as woman or man in competition... and my comment was removed and i was banned for 'hate speech'. saw several other really nuanced and subtle takes be removed as well.
most of these comments were heavily upvoted in the first few hours of the thread. About a day after the original thread/comments, a bunch of angry dipshits came into the really throughout discussions and just start plastering one liners to all of us about how hateful and fascist we were and probably dog-pile reported on them. My comment was a reply to a top comment, and got about a dozen angry insulting replies, and then it was removed and i was banned, 2-3 days after the comment was posted.
apparently the mod opinion was the federal government should abolish all gender in sports and anything that wasn't an overarching overreaching overbearing type of 'solution' was hateful and evil.
but in the eyes of bullies, everyone else is bullying them by existing and being different than them.
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I agree, but I don't think fairness or honesty really exists anymore. Or rather, there's no incentive for people to engage in such.
There is no tangible external incentive.
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There is no tangible external incentive.
I'd say be the change you want to see, but it seems pointless. Maybe once trump and putin carks it
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I'd say be the change you want to see, but it seems pointless. Maybe once trump and putin carks it
Doing what you believe is right is never pointless imo.
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Interestingly each community shows up kind of like a user in Mastodon.
I think hashtags should be communities but I can see from an ActivityPub POV that would be difficult to dynamically create. Worth while though.
It also makes sense that a mastodon user should kind of look like a community or a maybe user in Lemmy but I personally don't like following people and much rather follow topics.
Maybe there's only underlying posts and users to the fediverse, and the difference between Lemmy and Mastodon is mostly how they're organized and presented in the feed
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This is something I think whatever lemmy 2.0 is going to be really needs to focus on.
Just be a content aggregator for ALL of the fediverse. Everything. One feed.
Or maybe more clever ways of integrating. But right now, we're still relying on video mostly from YT (not peertube) and screenshots of things happening on mastodon. We need more connective tissue.
yeah i think to meaningfully embed peertube, we'd probably have to copy the peertube video player into the Lemmy frontend/app.
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I mean... Zero?
But fuck that would be pretty sweet.
It's not 100% it but it's close enough. Praise the white hat lords!
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75% of small communities, if not higher, don't use lemmy-federate to expand the visibility of their community. The user makes the community, broadcasts a few posts locally and then gets sad that no-one replies (because it can only be seen locally).
I use lemmy-federate a lot to help this, but it's sometimes too late after they set the comm up.
Good idea, thanks!
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You're right! That's perfect! that's what i was looking for, now i have a name to it. thank you. i think it would maybe work well enough if the sidebar could link to related communities?
We have an open issue for this: https://github.com/LemmyNet/lemmy/issues/5871
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I'm a reddit user and that's also where I first heard about lemmy the first time.
Yesterday I decided to give it a try, current events pushed me away from everything American and so I thought it was about time.
I searched for something like 'lemmy getting started' and landed on this site:
https://join-lemmy.org/docs/users/01-getting-started.htmlSo the first greeting is a wall of text. After I read through it, I found myself here:
https://join-lemmy.org/instancesNow I got a bunch of options with no real way to evaluate what's what. I spent some time there looking through the options and didn't really know what to choose and what the impact would be. I used a search engine again to look for some opinions about the biggest ones which lead me nowhere, mostly.
So I kinda gave up and selected programming.dev because that's close enough to what I do professionally. I clicked on join and was presented with this
https://programming.dev/signupSo I don't know if that differs from instance to instance, but you need a moment to process this. The first few fields are obvious but then it starts to get a little weird. Instead of a checkbox or even implicit accepting of TOS and privacy policy (by registering here you agree to....) you have to take or copy paste that exact sentence into that answer box with a preview button(?) and then fill in the captcha. After that you are told that your registration needs to be approved manually and that there is no notification about that so you have to manually check from time to time whether your are able to login or not.
But it didn't end here. Because I found that the webui wasn't that great on mobile, I wanted an Android app. So I ended up here: https://join-lemmy.org/apps
And yet again was confronted with a bunch options I somehow had to evaluate. I'm still in the process finding an app I really like.
Now I know this is no rocket science, and having options is a good thing usually.
But still considering the average usually not tech savvy user, all of that is too much by quite a bit. That's overwhelming for the majority of people.
This whole thing needs to be a 10 second streamlined process. There should be one button to get you started. The instance selection site tells you: 'You can access all content in the lemmyverse from any server, so it doesn't matter which one you choose.'
So if that's the case, why bother the user with it? I admit I know jack shit about the fediverse, but if I were to design such a thing, I'd separate the IdP (identity provider) from the service/content providers. Have a couple of them redundantly, hosted by different parties so one entity can not shut down everything. Let the user register once, replicate that identity across the IdPs and let some interest selection wizard determine which content instances the use should be added to.
I know that's a big architecture change and will never happen. So maybe have that one obvious registration routine for a user and choose a first instance for the user based on interests or randomly (from a curated list to prevent users landing on some extreme instances) if the user can not be bothered to fill in their interests.
Have one default app which is good and recommended that. Let the app have sensible defaults (like the sorting thing), present most popular content first to hook the user.
Let the user look for alternatives later if they want to do that.
Don't let the user do all the homework upfront before they even know whether they even care and if it's worth the effort. Most people simply won't do it.
PS. Nope I do not know about 'Piefed'. I'll check it out later. It wasn't mentioned on all that sites that I looked at and that's part of the problem.
That's just my 2 cents.
After that you are told that your registration needs to be approved manually and that there is no notification about that so you have to manually check from time to time whether your are able to login or not.
This is wrong or outdated, Lemmy definitely sends an email once your registration is approved or denied (if you provided an email during registration). Worth contacting the programming.dev admins to change this line.
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I'm a very new user who wanted to give this a chance, here are the friction points from my point of view:
- The onboarding is way too complicated for the average user. A huge part of this is that there are 100 ways to do it. Before you even can start to do anything you have to investigate and then decide on what and how to do it. And even then there is no guidance at all, you are given options and then you can either go and do some research again or try them one by one. You lose at least 90% of the users here already. It doesn't help that fediverse users try to downplay this issue.
- Content discovery sucks ass. My feed stayed mostly the same since I started using Lemmy. I'm presented the same shit over and over again. I'm not sure if it's something that I do wrong, if there is just no content or if that's a side effect of 'no tracking at all' but either way the experience is just bad
- Someone in here already said it, but 'Lemmy' is a horrendous name. That alone was the reason why I didn't bother to try it at all for a long time. Only recent events pushed me towards it but tbh I'm not sure I'll stay.
In short the user experience is abysmal.
The onboarding is way too complicated for the average user. A huge part of this is that there are 100 ways to do it. Before you even can start to do anything you have to investigate and then decide on what and how to do it. And even then there is no guidance at all, you are given options and then you can either go and do some research again or try them one by one. You lose at least 90% of the users here already. It doesn’t help that fediverse users try to downplay this issue.
The solution to this is that people should not recommend Lemmy, but a specific instance such as programming.dev (depending on the audience). The Lemmy software and join-lemmy.org are mainly targeted at potential instance admins, or those who are already familiar with the Fediverse.
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I am also new (coming from Reddit) and it was confusing that there was no register button anywhere.
There is a "Join" button which goes directly to the registration page of the respective instance. Would it be clearer to rename this? Other than that I'm also happy to make improvements if you have concrete suggestions.
Edit: Made a PR to rename Join to Sign Up: https://github.com/LemmyNet/joinlemmy-site/pull/509
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I believe they publicly stated they removed .world from it to prevent centralization because everyone was going to a single instance, thus defeating the fediverse purpose. But this is all from memory and I might be wrong
The logic it uses is to hide any instances with more than 30% of all active users to prevent centralization, just like you say. There are also some other filters like requiring at least 5 active users.
![Cowbee [he/they]](https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/c18ce632-5fb5-4888-8226-3dc55a07acc4.jpeg "Cowbee [he/they]"){kind=avatar}
