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Fun fact: you can't upload this image on piefed.social

Fediverse

178 Posts 57 Posters 8 Views

M machenni@procial.tchncs.de

@Eldritch@piefed.world @Cowbee@lemmy.ml this sounds like a defedration waiting to happening, if I'm intereprting their mission right.
C This user is from outside of this forum
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Cowbee [he/they]

wrote last edited by

#23

I dunno if they'll be defederated, they're small enough that they only have a few active users.
M 1 Reply Last reply

7
C Cowbee [he/they]

I dunno if they'll be defederated, they're small enough that they only have a few active users.
M This user is from outside of this forum
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machenni@procial.tchncs.de

wrote last edited by

#24

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml well, that may be the case, but…
C 1 Reply Last reply

0
M machenni@procial.tchncs.de

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml well, that may be the case, but…
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Cowbee [he/they]

wrote last edited by

#25

I don't think solipsism is grounds for defederation from most places. I disagree with it heavily, but it isn't CSAM or fascist.
M 1 Reply Last reply

8
C Cowbee [he/they]

I don't think solipsism is grounds for defederation from most places. I disagree with it heavily, but it isn't CSAM or fascist.
M This user is from outside of this forum
M This user is from outside of this forum
machenni@procial.tchncs.de

wrote last edited by

#26

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml Fair enough. As I mentioned in my original reply (I think), I am not familiar with the idea.
C M 2 Replies Last reply

0
M machenni@procial.tchncs.de

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml Fair enough. As I mentioned in my original reply (I think), I am not familiar with the idea.
C This user is from outside of this forum
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Cowbee [he/they]

wrote last edited by cowbee@lemmy.ml

#27

Solipsism pretty much died out a long time ago as an extreme form of idealism. It exists as a philosophical framework but that's about it.
1 Reply Last reply

7
M machenni@procial.tchncs.de

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml Fair enough. As I mentioned in my original reply (I think), I am not familiar with the idea.
M This user is from outside of this forum
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machenni@procial.tchncs.de

wrote last edited by

#28

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml I can see, though, that it's ego-fueled after looking up your word. I dunno. As you said, it really
C 1 Reply Last reply

3
M machenni@procial.tchncs.de

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml I can see, though, that it's ego-fueled after looking up your word. I dunno. As you said, it really
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Cowbee [he/they]

wrote last edited by

#29

Yea, I can't agree with it at all.
M 1 Reply Last reply

4
C Cowbee [he/they]

Yea, I can't agree with it at all.
M This user is from outside of this forum
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machenni@procial.tchncs.de

wrote last edited by

#30

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml My server (if I had one /sigh/) would defedrate it.
C 1 Reply Last reply

2
M machenni@procial.tchncs.de

@Cowbee@lemmy.ml My server (if I had one /sigh/) would defedrate it.
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Cowbee [he/they]

wrote last edited by

#31

I wouldn't blame you.
1 Reply Last reply

3
A RedWizard [he/him]
There are all kinds of fun stuff in the Piefed code. Allow me to dredge up a comment I made recently:

@edie@lemmy.encryptionin.space was looking at PieFed code the other week, and I ended up taking a look at it too. Its great fun to sneak a peak at.

For example, you cannot cast a vote on PieFed if you've made 0 replies, 0 posts, AND your username is 8 characters long:
```
    def cannot_vote(self):
        if self.is_local():
            return False
        return self.post_count == 0 and self.post_reply_count == 0 and len(
            self.user_name) == 8  # most vote manipulation bots have 8 character user names and never post any content
```
If a reply is created, from anywhere, that only contains the word "this", the comment is dropped (CW: ableism in the function name):
```
def reply_is_stupid(body) -> bool:
    lower_body = body.lower().strip()
    if lower_body == 'this' or lower_body == 'this.' or lower_body == 'this!':
        return True
    return False
```
Every user (remote or local) has an "attitude" which is calculated as follows: (upvotes cast - downvotes cast) / (upvotes + downvotes). If your "attitude" is < 0.0 you can't downvote.

Every account has a Social Credit Score, aka your Reputation. If your account has less than 100 reputation and is newly created, you are not considered "trustworthy" and there are limitations placed on what your account can do. Your reputation is calculated as upvotes earned - downvotes earned aka Reddit Karma. If your reputation is at -10 you also cannot downvote, and you can't create new DMs. It also flags your account automatically if your reputation is to low:

PieFed boasts that it has "4chan image detection". Let's see how that works in practice:
```
            if site.enable_chan_image_filter:
                # Do not allow fascist meme content
                try:
                    if '.avif' in uploaded_file.filename:
                        import pillow_avif  # NOQA
                    image_text = pytesseract.image_to_string(Image.open(BytesIO(uploaded_file.read())).convert('L'))
                except FileNotFoundError:
                    image_text = ''
                except UnidentifiedImageError:
                    image_text = ''

                if 'Anonymous' in image_text and (
                        'No.' in image_text or ' N0' in image_text):  # chan posts usually contain the text 'Anonymous' and ' No.12345'
                    self.image_file.errors.append(
                        "This image is an invalid file type.")  # deliberately misleading error message
                    current_user.reputation -= 1
                    db.session.commit()
                    return False
```
Yup. If your image contains the word Anonymous, and contains the text No. or N0 it will reject the image with a fake error message. Not only does it give you a fake error, but it also will dock your Social Credit Score. Take note of the current_user.reputation -= 1

PieFed also boasts that it has AI generated text detection. Let's see how that also works in practice:
```
# LLM Detection
        if reply.body and '—' in reply.body and user.created_very_recently():
            # usage of em-dash is highly suspect.
            from app.utils import notify_admin
            # notify admin
```
This is the default detection, apparently you can use an API endpoint for that detection as well apparently, but it's not documented anywhere but within the code.

Do you want to leave a comment that is just a funny gif? No you don't. Not on PieFed, that will get your comment dropped and lower your Social Credit Score!
```
        if reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(reply.body) and site.enable_gif_reply_rep_decrease:
            user.reputation -= 1
            raise PostReplyValidationError(_('Gif comment ignored'))
```
How does it know its just a gif though?
```
def reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(body) -> bool:
    tmp_body = body.strip()
    if tmp_body.startswith('https://media.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.imgflip.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media4.giphy.com/'):
        return True
    else:
        return False
```
I'm not even sure someone would actually drop a link like this directly into a comment. It's not even taking into consideration whether those URLs are part of a markdown image tag.

As Edie mentioned, if someone has a user blocked, and that user replies to someone, their comment is dropped:
```
if parent_comment.author.has_blocked_user(user.id) or parent_comment.author.has_blocked_instance(user.instance_id):
    log_incoming_ap(id, APLOG_CREATE, APLOG_FAILURE, saved_json, 'Parent comment author blocked replier')
    return None
```
For Example:
- Cowbees comment on lemmy.ml: https://lemmy.ml/post/41587312/23288779
- Non-existent on piefed.social: https://piefed.social/comment/9647830
(see Edies original comment here)

More from Edie:

Also add if the poster has blocked you! It is exactly as nonsense as you think.

Example:

I made a post in testing@piefed.social from my account testingpiefed@piefed.social, replied to it from my other testingpiefed@piefed.zip account. Since the .social account has blocked the .zip, it doesn't show up on .social, nor on e.g. piefed.europe.pub.

I then made a comment from my lemmy.ml account, and replied to it from my piefed.zip account, and neither .social, nor europe.pub can see my .zip reply, but can see my lemmy.ml comment!

[ Let me add more clarity here: what this feature does is two things. On a local instance, if you block someone who is on your instance, they cannot reply to you. However, this condition is not federated (yet, it would seem), and so, to get around this "issue", the system will drop comments from being stored in the PieFed database IF the blocked user is remote. This means you end up with "ghost comment chains" on remote instances. There is NEW code as of a few weeks ago, that will send an AUTOMATED mod action against blocked remote users to remove the comment. So long as the community is a local PieFed community, it will federate that mod action to the remote server, removing the comment automatically. For PieFed servers, eventually, they would rather federate the users block list (that's fair), but it would seem this code to send automated mod actions to remove comments due to user blocks is going to stay just for the Lemmy Piefed interaction. I don't really understand why the system simply doesn't prevent the rendering of the comment, instead of stopping it from being stored. It knows the user is blocked, it already checks it, it should then just stop rendering the chain of comments for the given user, prevent notifications from those users, etc. ]

But wait! There's More!
- PieFed defederates from Hexbear.net, Lemmygrad.ml, and Lemmy.ml out of the box.
- The "rational discourse" sidebar that you see on the main instance is hard coded into the system.
- ~~Moderators of a community can kick you from a community, which unsubscribes you from it, and does not notify you.~~ This has been removed actually, the API endpoint is still there.
- I was going to say that Admins had the ability to add a weight to votes coming from other instances, but the videos that showed this are now gone, and as of v1.5.0 they have removed the instance vote weight feature, claiming it was "unused".
All this to say. Piefed is a silly place, and no one should bother using its software.
M This user is from outside of this forum
M This user is from outside of this forum
magiccupcake@lemmy.world

wrote last edited by magiccupcake@lemmy.world

#32
Every user (remote or local) has an "attitude" which is calculated as follows: `(upvotes cast - downvotes cast) / (upvotes + downvotes)`. If your "attitude" is < 0.0 you can't downvote.

This pains me because it is functionally equivalent to
```
If downvotes cast < upvotes cast
```
B S 2 Replies Last reply

43
I irelephant [he/him]

https://codeberg.org/rimu/pyfedi/src/commit/6405e51dab23f43eaea18d0ee4d9e7a773a3fd31/app/community/forms.py#L335

deliberately misleading error message.
R This user is from outside of this forum
R This user is from outside of this forum
Rimu

wrote last edited by

#33

If anyone has more ideas for how to frustrate and deceive fascists (and their enablers) please let me know.
G S 2 Replies Last reply

5
A RedWizard [he/him]
There are all kinds of fun stuff in the Piefed code. Allow me to dredge up a comment I made recently:

@edie@lemmy.encryptionin.space was looking at PieFed code the other week, and I ended up taking a look at it too. Its great fun to sneak a peak at.

For example, you cannot cast a vote on PieFed if you've made 0 replies, 0 posts, AND your username is 8 characters long:
```
    def cannot_vote(self):
        if self.is_local():
            return False
        return self.post_count == 0 and self.post_reply_count == 0 and len(
            self.user_name) == 8  # most vote manipulation bots have 8 character user names and never post any content
```
If a reply is created, from anywhere, that only contains the word "this", the comment is dropped (CW: ableism in the function name):
```
def reply_is_stupid(body) -> bool:
    lower_body = body.lower().strip()
    if lower_body == 'this' or lower_body == 'this.' or lower_body == 'this!':
        return True
    return False
```
Every user (remote or local) has an "attitude" which is calculated as follows: (upvotes cast - downvotes cast) / (upvotes + downvotes). If your "attitude" is < 0.0 you can't downvote.

Every account has a Social Credit Score, aka your Reputation. If your account has less than 100 reputation and is newly created, you are not considered "trustworthy" and there are limitations placed on what your account can do. Your reputation is calculated as upvotes earned - downvotes earned aka Reddit Karma. If your reputation is at -10 you also cannot downvote, and you can't create new DMs. It also flags your account automatically if your reputation is to low:

PieFed boasts that it has "4chan image detection". Let's see how that works in practice:
```
            if site.enable_chan_image_filter:
                # Do not allow fascist meme content
                try:
                    if '.avif' in uploaded_file.filename:
                        import pillow_avif  # NOQA
                    image_text = pytesseract.image_to_string(Image.open(BytesIO(uploaded_file.read())).convert('L'))
                except FileNotFoundError:
                    image_text = ''
                except UnidentifiedImageError:
                    image_text = ''

                if 'Anonymous' in image_text and (
                        'No.' in image_text or ' N0' in image_text):  # chan posts usually contain the text 'Anonymous' and ' No.12345'
                    self.image_file.errors.append(
                        "This image is an invalid file type.")  # deliberately misleading error message
                    current_user.reputation -= 1
                    db.session.commit()
                    return False
```
Yup. If your image contains the word Anonymous, and contains the text No. or N0 it will reject the image with a fake error message. Not only does it give you a fake error, but it also will dock your Social Credit Score. Take note of the current_user.reputation -= 1

PieFed also boasts that it has AI generated text detection. Let's see how that also works in practice:
```
# LLM Detection
        if reply.body and '—' in reply.body and user.created_very_recently():
            # usage of em-dash is highly suspect.
            from app.utils import notify_admin
            # notify admin
```
This is the default detection, apparently you can use an API endpoint for that detection as well apparently, but it's not documented anywhere but within the code.

Do you want to leave a comment that is just a funny gif? No you don't. Not on PieFed, that will get your comment dropped and lower your Social Credit Score!
```
        if reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(reply.body) and site.enable_gif_reply_rep_decrease:
            user.reputation -= 1
            raise PostReplyValidationError(_('Gif comment ignored'))
```
How does it know its just a gif though?
```
def reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(body) -> bool:
    tmp_body = body.strip()
    if tmp_body.startswith('https://media.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.imgflip.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media4.giphy.com/'):
        return True
    else:
        return False
```
I'm not even sure someone would actually drop a link like this directly into a comment. It's not even taking into consideration whether those URLs are part of a markdown image tag.

As Edie mentioned, if someone has a user blocked, and that user replies to someone, their comment is dropped:
```
if parent_comment.author.has_blocked_user(user.id) or parent_comment.author.has_blocked_instance(user.instance_id):
    log_incoming_ap(id, APLOG_CREATE, APLOG_FAILURE, saved_json, 'Parent comment author blocked replier')
    return None
```
For Example:
- Cowbees comment on lemmy.ml: https://lemmy.ml/post/41587312/23288779
- Non-existent on piefed.social: https://piefed.social/comment/9647830
(see Edies original comment here)

More from Edie:

Also add if the poster has blocked you! It is exactly as nonsense as you think.

Example:

I made a post in testing@piefed.social from my account testingpiefed@piefed.social, replied to it from my other testingpiefed@piefed.zip account. Since the .social account has blocked the .zip, it doesn't show up on .social, nor on e.g. piefed.europe.pub.

I then made a comment from my lemmy.ml account, and replied to it from my piefed.zip account, and neither .social, nor europe.pub can see my .zip reply, but can see my lemmy.ml comment!

[ Let me add more clarity here: what this feature does is two things. On a local instance, if you block someone who is on your instance, they cannot reply to you. However, this condition is not federated (yet, it would seem), and so, to get around this "issue", the system will drop comments from being stored in the PieFed database IF the blocked user is remote. This means you end up with "ghost comment chains" on remote instances. There is NEW code as of a few weeks ago, that will send an AUTOMATED mod action against blocked remote users to remove the comment. So long as the community is a local PieFed community, it will federate that mod action to the remote server, removing the comment automatically. For PieFed servers, eventually, they would rather federate the users block list (that's fair), but it would seem this code to send automated mod actions to remove comments due to user blocks is going to stay just for the Lemmy Piefed interaction. I don't really understand why the system simply doesn't prevent the rendering of the comment, instead of stopping it from being stored. It knows the user is blocked, it already checks it, it should then just stop rendering the chain of comments for the given user, prevent notifications from those users, etc. ]

But wait! There's More!
- PieFed defederates from Hexbear.net, Lemmygrad.ml, and Lemmy.ml out of the box.
- The "rational discourse" sidebar that you see on the main instance is hard coded into the system.
- ~~Moderators of a community can kick you from a community, which unsubscribes you from it, and does not notify you.~~ This has been removed actually, the API endpoint is still there.
- I was going to say that Admins had the ability to add a weight to votes coming from other instances, but the videos that showed this are now gone, and as of v1.5.0 they have removed the instance vote weight feature, claiming it was "unused".
All this to say. Piefed is a silly place, and no one should bother using its software.
B This user is from outside of this forum
B This user is from outside of this forum
bb84@mander.xyz

wrote last edited by bb84@mander.xyz

#34

lol hardcoded shit everywhere. that codebase is so bad it's entertaining. you should make a standalone post about this here and crosspost to !programming_horror@programming.dev
P 1 Reply Last reply

62
M magiccupcake@lemmy.world
Every user (remote or local) has an "attitude" which is calculated as follows: `(upvotes cast - downvotes cast) / (upvotes + downvotes)`. If your "attitude" is < 0.0 you can't downvote.

This pains me because it is functionally equivalent to
```
If downvotes cast < upvotes cast
```
B This user is from outside of this forum
B This user is from outside of this forum
bb84@mander.xyz

wrote last edited by

#35

not if both upvotes and downvotes are zero ️
M 1 Reply Last reply

11
A RedWizard [he/him]
There are all kinds of fun stuff in the Piefed code. Allow me to dredge up a comment I made recently:

@edie@lemmy.encryptionin.space was looking at PieFed code the other week, and I ended up taking a look at it too. Its great fun to sneak a peak at.

For example, you cannot cast a vote on PieFed if you've made 0 replies, 0 posts, AND your username is 8 characters long:
```
    def cannot_vote(self):
        if self.is_local():
            return False
        return self.post_count == 0 and self.post_reply_count == 0 and len(
            self.user_name) == 8  # most vote manipulation bots have 8 character user names and never post any content
```
If a reply is created, from anywhere, that only contains the word "this", the comment is dropped (CW: ableism in the function name):
```
def reply_is_stupid(body) -> bool:
    lower_body = body.lower().strip()
    if lower_body == 'this' or lower_body == 'this.' or lower_body == 'this!':
        return True
    return False
```
Every user (remote or local) has an "attitude" which is calculated as follows: (upvotes cast - downvotes cast) / (upvotes + downvotes). If your "attitude" is < 0.0 you can't downvote.

Every account has a Social Credit Score, aka your Reputation. If your account has less than 100 reputation and is newly created, you are not considered "trustworthy" and there are limitations placed on what your account can do. Your reputation is calculated as upvotes earned - downvotes earned aka Reddit Karma. If your reputation is at -10 you also cannot downvote, and you can't create new DMs. It also flags your account automatically if your reputation is to low:

PieFed boasts that it has "4chan image detection". Let's see how that works in practice:
```
            if site.enable_chan_image_filter:
                # Do not allow fascist meme content
                try:
                    if '.avif' in uploaded_file.filename:
                        import pillow_avif  # NOQA
                    image_text = pytesseract.image_to_string(Image.open(BytesIO(uploaded_file.read())).convert('L'))
                except FileNotFoundError:
                    image_text = ''
                except UnidentifiedImageError:
                    image_text = ''

                if 'Anonymous' in image_text and (
                        'No.' in image_text or ' N0' in image_text):  # chan posts usually contain the text 'Anonymous' and ' No.12345'
                    self.image_file.errors.append(
                        "This image is an invalid file type.")  # deliberately misleading error message
                    current_user.reputation -= 1
                    db.session.commit()
                    return False
```
Yup. If your image contains the word Anonymous, and contains the text No. or N0 it will reject the image with a fake error message. Not only does it give you a fake error, but it also will dock your Social Credit Score. Take note of the current_user.reputation -= 1

PieFed also boasts that it has AI generated text detection. Let's see how that also works in practice:
```
# LLM Detection
        if reply.body and '—' in reply.body and user.created_very_recently():
            # usage of em-dash is highly suspect.
            from app.utils import notify_admin
            # notify admin
```
This is the default detection, apparently you can use an API endpoint for that detection as well apparently, but it's not documented anywhere but within the code.

Do you want to leave a comment that is just a funny gif? No you don't. Not on PieFed, that will get your comment dropped and lower your Social Credit Score!
```
        if reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(reply.body) and site.enable_gif_reply_rep_decrease:
            user.reputation -= 1
            raise PostReplyValidationError(_('Gif comment ignored'))
```
How does it know its just a gif though?
```
def reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(body) -> bool:
    tmp_body = body.strip()
    if tmp_body.startswith('https://media.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.imgflip.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media4.giphy.com/'):
        return True
    else:
        return False
```
I'm not even sure someone would actually drop a link like this directly into a comment. It's not even taking into consideration whether those URLs are part of a markdown image tag.

As Edie mentioned, if someone has a user blocked, and that user replies to someone, their comment is dropped:
```
if parent_comment.author.has_blocked_user(user.id) or parent_comment.author.has_blocked_instance(user.instance_id):
    log_incoming_ap(id, APLOG_CREATE, APLOG_FAILURE, saved_json, 'Parent comment author blocked replier')
    return None
```
For Example:
- Cowbees comment on lemmy.ml: https://lemmy.ml/post/41587312/23288779
- Non-existent on piefed.social: https://piefed.social/comment/9647830
(see Edies original comment here)

More from Edie:

Also add if the poster has blocked you! It is exactly as nonsense as you think.

Example:

I made a post in testing@piefed.social from my account testingpiefed@piefed.social, replied to it from my other testingpiefed@piefed.zip account. Since the .social account has blocked the .zip, it doesn't show up on .social, nor on e.g. piefed.europe.pub.

I then made a comment from my lemmy.ml account, and replied to it from my piefed.zip account, and neither .social, nor europe.pub can see my .zip reply, but can see my lemmy.ml comment!

[ Let me add more clarity here: what this feature does is two things. On a local instance, if you block someone who is on your instance, they cannot reply to you. However, this condition is not federated (yet, it would seem), and so, to get around this "issue", the system will drop comments from being stored in the PieFed database IF the blocked user is remote. This means you end up with "ghost comment chains" on remote instances. There is NEW code as of a few weeks ago, that will send an AUTOMATED mod action against blocked remote users to remove the comment. So long as the community is a local PieFed community, it will federate that mod action to the remote server, removing the comment automatically. For PieFed servers, eventually, they would rather federate the users block list (that's fair), but it would seem this code to send automated mod actions to remove comments due to user blocks is going to stay just for the Lemmy Piefed interaction. I don't really understand why the system simply doesn't prevent the rendering of the comment, instead of stopping it from being stored. It knows the user is blocked, it already checks it, it should then just stop rendering the chain of comments for the given user, prevent notifications from those users, etc. ]

But wait! There's More!
- PieFed defederates from Hexbear.net, Lemmygrad.ml, and Lemmy.ml out of the box.
- The "rational discourse" sidebar that you see on the main instance is hard coded into the system.
- ~~Moderators of a community can kick you from a community, which unsubscribes you from it, and does not notify you.~~ This has been removed actually, the API endpoint is still there.
- I was going to say that Admins had the ability to add a weight to votes coming from other instances, but the videos that showed this are now gone, and as of v1.5.0 they have removed the instance vote weight feature, claiming it was "unused".
All this to say. Piefed is a silly place, and no one should bother using its software.
K This user is from outside of this forum
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🇰 🌀 🇱 🇦 🇳 🇦 🇰 🇮

wrote last edited by

#36

Was wondering what those red exclamations were on some piefed users. Also surprising that I see them using a Lemmy client on a Lemmy instance, but can't click on them to see what they mean, as highlighted here.
C W I 3 Replies Last reply

5
B bb84@mander.xyz

not if both upvotes and downvotes are zero ️
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magiccupcake@lemmy.world

wrote last edited by

#37

If 0/0 < 0 would error?

If 0 < 0 evaluates false

That makes it even worse???
B 1 Reply Last reply

20
K 🇰 🌀 🇱 🇦 🇳 🇦 🇰 🇮

Was wondering what those red exclamations were on some piefed users. Also surprising that I see them using a Lemmy client on a Lemmy instance, but can't click on them to see what they mean, as highlighted here.
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Cowbee [he/they]

wrote last edited by

#38

Are you on the web client, or using an app?
1 Reply Last reply

6
K 🇰 🌀 🇱 🇦 🇳 🇦 🇰 🇮

Was wondering what those red exclamations were on some piefed users. Also surprising that I see them using a Lemmy client on a Lemmy instance, but can't click on them to see what they mean, as highlighted here.
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wjs018

wrote last edited by

#39

If you are seeing those on lemmy or in a different client than the web ui, that would have to be something else. The red triangles don't federate at all, nor are they in the api, they are just based on the local content of a user on that instance.
1 Reply Last reply

8
A RedWizard [he/him]
There are all kinds of fun stuff in the Piefed code. Allow me to dredge up a comment I made recently:

@edie@lemmy.encryptionin.space was looking at PieFed code the other week, and I ended up taking a look at it too. Its great fun to sneak a peak at.

For example, you cannot cast a vote on PieFed if you've made 0 replies, 0 posts, AND your username is 8 characters long:
```
    def cannot_vote(self):
        if self.is_local():
            return False
        return self.post_count == 0 and self.post_reply_count == 0 and len(
            self.user_name) == 8  # most vote manipulation bots have 8 character user names and never post any content
```
If a reply is created, from anywhere, that only contains the word "this", the comment is dropped (CW: ableism in the function name):
```
def reply_is_stupid(body) -> bool:
    lower_body = body.lower().strip()
    if lower_body == 'this' or lower_body == 'this.' or lower_body == 'this!':
        return True
    return False
```
Every user (remote or local) has an "attitude" which is calculated as follows: (upvotes cast - downvotes cast) / (upvotes + downvotes). If your "attitude" is < 0.0 you can't downvote.

Every account has a Social Credit Score, aka your Reputation. If your account has less than 100 reputation and is newly created, you are not considered "trustworthy" and there are limitations placed on what your account can do. Your reputation is calculated as upvotes earned - downvotes earned aka Reddit Karma. If your reputation is at -10 you also cannot downvote, and you can't create new DMs. It also flags your account automatically if your reputation is to low:

PieFed boasts that it has "4chan image detection". Let's see how that works in practice:
```
            if site.enable_chan_image_filter:
                # Do not allow fascist meme content
                try:
                    if '.avif' in uploaded_file.filename:
                        import pillow_avif  # NOQA
                    image_text = pytesseract.image_to_string(Image.open(BytesIO(uploaded_file.read())).convert('L'))
                except FileNotFoundError:
                    image_text = ''
                except UnidentifiedImageError:
                    image_text = ''

                if 'Anonymous' in image_text and (
                        'No.' in image_text or ' N0' in image_text):  # chan posts usually contain the text 'Anonymous' and ' No.12345'
                    self.image_file.errors.append(
                        "This image is an invalid file type.")  # deliberately misleading error message
                    current_user.reputation -= 1
                    db.session.commit()
                    return False
```
Yup. If your image contains the word Anonymous, and contains the text No. or N0 it will reject the image with a fake error message. Not only does it give you a fake error, but it also will dock your Social Credit Score. Take note of the current_user.reputation -= 1

PieFed also boasts that it has AI generated text detection. Let's see how that also works in practice:
```
# LLM Detection
        if reply.body and '—' in reply.body and user.created_very_recently():
            # usage of em-dash is highly suspect.
            from app.utils import notify_admin
            # notify admin
```
This is the default detection, apparently you can use an API endpoint for that detection as well apparently, but it's not documented anywhere but within the code.

Do you want to leave a comment that is just a funny gif? No you don't. Not on PieFed, that will get your comment dropped and lower your Social Credit Score!
```
        if reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(reply.body) and site.enable_gif_reply_rep_decrease:
            user.reputation -= 1
            raise PostReplyValidationError(_('Gif comment ignored'))
```
How does it know its just a gif though?
```
def reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(body) -> bool:
    tmp_body = body.strip()
    if tmp_body.startswith('https://media.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.imgflip.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media4.giphy.com/'):
        return True
    else:
        return False
```
I'm not even sure someone would actually drop a link like this directly into a comment. It's not even taking into consideration whether those URLs are part of a markdown image tag.

As Edie mentioned, if someone has a user blocked, and that user replies to someone, their comment is dropped:
```
if parent_comment.author.has_blocked_user(user.id) or parent_comment.author.has_blocked_instance(user.instance_id):
    log_incoming_ap(id, APLOG_CREATE, APLOG_FAILURE, saved_json, 'Parent comment author blocked replier')
    return None
```
For Example:
- Cowbees comment on lemmy.ml: https://lemmy.ml/post/41587312/23288779
- Non-existent on piefed.social: https://piefed.social/comment/9647830
(see Edies original comment here)

More from Edie:

Also add if the poster has blocked you! It is exactly as nonsense as you think.

Example:

I made a post in testing@piefed.social from my account testingpiefed@piefed.social, replied to it from my other testingpiefed@piefed.zip account. Since the .social account has blocked the .zip, it doesn't show up on .social, nor on e.g. piefed.europe.pub.

I then made a comment from my lemmy.ml account, and replied to it from my piefed.zip account, and neither .social, nor europe.pub can see my .zip reply, but can see my lemmy.ml comment!

[ Let me add more clarity here: what this feature does is two things. On a local instance, if you block someone who is on your instance, they cannot reply to you. However, this condition is not federated (yet, it would seem), and so, to get around this "issue", the system will drop comments from being stored in the PieFed database IF the blocked user is remote. This means you end up with "ghost comment chains" on remote instances. There is NEW code as of a few weeks ago, that will send an AUTOMATED mod action against blocked remote users to remove the comment. So long as the community is a local PieFed community, it will federate that mod action to the remote server, removing the comment automatically. For PieFed servers, eventually, they would rather federate the users block list (that's fair), but it would seem this code to send automated mod actions to remove comments due to user blocks is going to stay just for the Lemmy Piefed interaction. I don't really understand why the system simply doesn't prevent the rendering of the comment, instead of stopping it from being stored. It knows the user is blocked, it already checks it, it should then just stop rendering the chain of comments for the given user, prevent notifications from those users, etc. ]

But wait! There's More!
- PieFed defederates from Hexbear.net, Lemmygrad.ml, and Lemmy.ml out of the box.
- The "rational discourse" sidebar that you see on the main instance is hard coded into the system.
- ~~Moderators of a community can kick you from a community, which unsubscribes you from it, and does not notify you.~~ This has been removed actually, the API endpoint is still there.
- I was going to say that Admins had the ability to add a weight to votes coming from other instances, but the videos that showed this are now gone, and as of v1.5.0 they have removed the instance vote weight feature, claiming it was "unused".
All this to say. Piefed is a silly place, and no one should bother using its software.
W This user is from outside of this forum
W This user is from outside of this forum
wjs018

wrote last edited by

#40

I know the blocking stuff is actively being worked on as we aren't happy with it yet. However, that is an issue where it would be literally impossible for every user to be happy with whatever end state it results in. That is an area where the different software platforms can offer people different experiences so that they can seek out the type of experience they are looking for.

Almost everything else you listed here can be turned on/off by an admin. I didn't know about the 8-character username thing, probably worth revisiting that. The downvotes being disabled with low attitude is one I don't see being removed, but could be an admin-set threshold (or disabled) in a future version. In fact, I suspect that the formula was written this way to make the threshold more well bounded instead of a simple up - down calculation.
1 Reply Last reply

12
A RedWizard [he/him]
There are all kinds of fun stuff in the Piefed code. Allow me to dredge up a comment I made recently:

@edie@lemmy.encryptionin.space was looking at PieFed code the other week, and I ended up taking a look at it too. Its great fun to sneak a peak at.

For example, you cannot cast a vote on PieFed if you've made 0 replies, 0 posts, AND your username is 8 characters long:
```
    def cannot_vote(self):
        if self.is_local():
            return False
        return self.post_count == 0 and self.post_reply_count == 0 and len(
            self.user_name) == 8  # most vote manipulation bots have 8 character user names and never post any content
```
If a reply is created, from anywhere, that only contains the word "this", the comment is dropped (CW: ableism in the function name):
```
def reply_is_stupid(body) -> bool:
    lower_body = body.lower().strip()
    if lower_body == 'this' or lower_body == 'this.' or lower_body == 'this!':
        return True
    return False
```
Every user (remote or local) has an "attitude" which is calculated as follows: (upvotes cast - downvotes cast) / (upvotes + downvotes). If your "attitude" is < 0.0 you can't downvote.

Every account has a Social Credit Score, aka your Reputation. If your account has less than 100 reputation and is newly created, you are not considered "trustworthy" and there are limitations placed on what your account can do. Your reputation is calculated as upvotes earned - downvotes earned aka Reddit Karma. If your reputation is at -10 you also cannot downvote, and you can't create new DMs. It also flags your account automatically if your reputation is to low:

PieFed boasts that it has "4chan image detection". Let's see how that works in practice:
```
            if site.enable_chan_image_filter:
                # Do not allow fascist meme content
                try:
                    if '.avif' in uploaded_file.filename:
                        import pillow_avif  # NOQA
                    image_text = pytesseract.image_to_string(Image.open(BytesIO(uploaded_file.read())).convert('L'))
                except FileNotFoundError:
                    image_text = ''
                except UnidentifiedImageError:
                    image_text = ''

                if 'Anonymous' in image_text and (
                        'No.' in image_text or ' N0' in image_text):  # chan posts usually contain the text 'Anonymous' and ' No.12345'
                    self.image_file.errors.append(
                        "This image is an invalid file type.")  # deliberately misleading error message
                    current_user.reputation -= 1
                    db.session.commit()
                    return False
```
Yup. If your image contains the word Anonymous, and contains the text No. or N0 it will reject the image with a fake error message. Not only does it give you a fake error, but it also will dock your Social Credit Score. Take note of the current_user.reputation -= 1

PieFed also boasts that it has AI generated text detection. Let's see how that also works in practice:
```
# LLM Detection
        if reply.body and '—' in reply.body and user.created_very_recently():
            # usage of em-dash is highly suspect.
            from app.utils import notify_admin
            # notify admin
```
This is the default detection, apparently you can use an API endpoint for that detection as well apparently, but it's not documented anywhere but within the code.

Do you want to leave a comment that is just a funny gif? No you don't. Not on PieFed, that will get your comment dropped and lower your Social Credit Score!
```
        if reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(reply.body) and site.enable_gif_reply_rep_decrease:
            user.reputation -= 1
            raise PostReplyValidationError(_('Gif comment ignored'))
```
How does it know its just a gif though?
```
def reply_is_just_link_to_gif_reaction(body) -> bool:
    tmp_body = body.strip()
    if tmp_body.startswith('https://media.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.tenor.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://i.imgflip.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media1.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media2.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media3.giphy.com/') or \
            tmp_body.startswith('https://media4.giphy.com/'):
        return True
    else:
        return False
```
I'm not even sure someone would actually drop a link like this directly into a comment. It's not even taking into consideration whether those URLs are part of a markdown image tag.

As Edie mentioned, if someone has a user blocked, and that user replies to someone, their comment is dropped:
```
if parent_comment.author.has_blocked_user(user.id) or parent_comment.author.has_blocked_instance(user.instance_id):
    log_incoming_ap(id, APLOG_CREATE, APLOG_FAILURE, saved_json, 'Parent comment author blocked replier')
    return None
```
For Example:
- Cowbees comment on lemmy.ml: https://lemmy.ml/post/41587312/23288779
- Non-existent on piefed.social: https://piefed.social/comment/9647830
(see Edies original comment here)

More from Edie:

Also add if the poster has blocked you! It is exactly as nonsense as you think.

Example:

I made a post in testing@piefed.social from my account testingpiefed@piefed.social, replied to it from my other testingpiefed@piefed.zip account. Since the .social account has blocked the .zip, it doesn't show up on .social, nor on e.g. piefed.europe.pub.

I then made a comment from my lemmy.ml account, and replied to it from my piefed.zip account, and neither .social, nor europe.pub can see my .zip reply, but can see my lemmy.ml comment!

[ Let me add more clarity here: what this feature does is two things. On a local instance, if you block someone who is on your instance, they cannot reply to you. However, this condition is not federated (yet, it would seem), and so, to get around this "issue", the system will drop comments from being stored in the PieFed database IF the blocked user is remote. This means you end up with "ghost comment chains" on remote instances. There is NEW code as of a few weeks ago, that will send an AUTOMATED mod action against blocked remote users to remove the comment. So long as the community is a local PieFed community, it will federate that mod action to the remote server, removing the comment automatically. For PieFed servers, eventually, they would rather federate the users block list (that's fair), but it would seem this code to send automated mod actions to remove comments due to user blocks is going to stay just for the Lemmy Piefed interaction. I don't really understand why the system simply doesn't prevent the rendering of the comment, instead of stopping it from being stored. It knows the user is blocked, it already checks it, it should then just stop rendering the chain of comments for the given user, prevent notifications from those users, etc. ]

But wait! There's More!
- PieFed defederates from Hexbear.net, Lemmygrad.ml, and Lemmy.ml out of the box.
- The "rational discourse" sidebar that you see on the main instance is hard coded into the system.
- ~~Moderators of a community can kick you from a community, which unsubscribes you from it, and does not notify you.~~ This has been removed actually, the API endpoint is still there.
- I was going to say that Admins had the ability to add a weight to votes coming from other instances, but the videos that showed this are now gone, and as of v1.5.0 they have removed the instance vote weight feature, claiming it was "unused".
All this to say. Piefed is a silly place, and no one should bother using its software.
P This user is from outside of this forum
P This user is from outside of this forum
postimo@lemmy.zip

wrote last edited by

#41

Phew, well thank goodness all the users are safe from authoritarian red fascist code!
1 Reply Last reply

29
G Grail

Thorn fiasco?
I This user is from outside of this forum
I This user is from outside of this forum
irelephant [he/him]

wrote last edited by

#42

Iirc, a thing was added that converted the thorn character to a th because some user was annoying everyone by using thorns instead of ths.
F L 2 Replies Last reply

14