we need more users
-
As a developer for a Lemmy app, recently I've felt Lemmy become more and more fragmented resulting in a poorer than usual user experience. And the base user experience is already poor. I'm mostly just venting but man is the fragmentation annoying to deal with as a developer and as a user.
Let's stop working on "Lemmy app" , "mbin app", "PieFed app", "Mastodon app" and just embrace ActivityPub as the single API.
-
I've been one of the people saying "we don't need more users. we need quality over quantity" and i was wrong.
the way it's going, lemmy needs active users who post content sothat the network stays relevant. networks like the fediverse benefit from network effects and that means that if we have more users, that improves the value and quality of the fediverse overall.
So please, everyone, when you can, make advertisement for the fediverse in your personal area. Go talk to friends, make attractive stickers and put them everywhere, stuff like that. We would all benefit from it.
edit: source for the graph
After trying to convert a friend who heavily uses reddit, multiple times, I recommended him again the other day to leave the hellsite (reddit).
I didn't recommend Lemmy but have a while back.
He himself specifically brought up that he 'didn't vibe with Lemmy as much as reddit' and that he believes he would 'miss stories he would otherwise have liked to see' by switching to Lemmy.
Reddit has kept him more up to date than not over the past year - he believes had he not been using reddit he wouldn't have found out about [specific events in iran] as early as he did.
The other main pain point I've encountered is the small and niche community problem, which I'm sure we are all aware of - certain information feels like it can only be found on such small subreddits.
Therefore I have two suggestions:
- create a Lemmy instance that mirrors reddit, rather than have bots post reddit posts onto main Lemmy instances, create an instance that mirrors specific subreddits on request, including the comments of their posts, and allows Lemmy users to comment and reply back, where those comments are also propagated to reddit so that replies and discussion are mirrored also.
This would struggle due to reddit API and compute power requirements but the subreddits on request and a specific instance for these posts would eliminate the bot spam problem from earlier attempts at the same thing.
- potentially allow the user to associate their reddit account with the instance so comments etc can proliferate without bot recognition.
The other suggestion would be:
- set up trackers for major (and newly popular) subreddits, tag posts by priority, and use this set of posts to determine what content and types of content are missing, but don't just automatically post everything as the spam problem gets out of hand.
Finally, my biggest gripe with my Lemmy use is the constant instance wars.
I have had my comments removed for being rightfully critical of Israel by lemmy.world mods. They appear intent on recreating the problems of reddit here.
-
After trying to convert a friend who heavily uses reddit, multiple times, I recommended him again the other day to leave the hellsite (reddit).
I didn't recommend Lemmy but have a while back.
He himself specifically brought up that he 'didn't vibe with Lemmy as much as reddit' and that he believes he would 'miss stories he would otherwise have liked to see' by switching to Lemmy.
Reddit has kept him more up to date than not over the past year - he believes had he not been using reddit he wouldn't have found out about [specific events in iran] as early as he did.
The other main pain point I've encountered is the small and niche community problem, which I'm sure we are all aware of - certain information feels like it can only be found on such small subreddits.
Therefore I have two suggestions:
- create a Lemmy instance that mirrors reddit, rather than have bots post reddit posts onto main Lemmy instances, create an instance that mirrors specific subreddits on request, including the comments of their posts, and allows Lemmy users to comment and reply back, where those comments are also propagated to reddit so that replies and discussion are mirrored also.
This would struggle due to reddit API and compute power requirements but the subreddits on request and a specific instance for these posts would eliminate the bot spam problem from earlier attempts at the same thing.
- potentially allow the user to associate their reddit account with the instance so comments etc can proliferate without bot recognition.
The other suggestion would be:
- set up trackers for major (and newly popular) subreddits, tag posts by priority, and use this set of posts to determine what content and types of content are missing, but don't just automatically post everything as the spam problem gets out of hand.
Finally, my biggest gripe with my Lemmy use is the constant instance wars.
I have had my comments removed for being rightfully critical of Israel by lemmy.world mods. They appear intent on recreating the problems of reddit here.
Posted as a reply because this will certainly upset many but...
On the instance wars:
I constantly see nonsense about the horrors of the '.ML' instance, and 'hexbear', primarily from 'Lemmy.world' users, but I have never once actually come across these horrors.
Hexbear is just a troll instance, ala 'cumtown'.
To an outside observer, '.world' users seem to be US propagandists intent on wrecking the platform. "Tankies this, cowbee that", when I've never seen a cowbee post that wasn't entirely reasonable.
And the vast majority of 'tankies' are just people who criticise the US rightfully while not sharing the same breathe to criticize China.
Ngl, fuck Russia, the US and Russia are the greatest evils. China is not anywhere near the same level. You can praise elements of a foreign state without being a 'tankie'.It's the same thought terminating cliche cult bullshit that all right wingers do. And it seems to come from Americans being upset their myopic views aren't babied by people who literally specifically went to an instance to avoid them?
Idk I'm not a user of any of the three, but I've only ever had an issue with lemmy.world users in the past, as a UK citizen who is far from a tankie.
-
Shameless plug.
If you are into computer RPGs (CRPGs), we have a relatively active community:
!crpg@lemmy.world
The JRPG community is also pretty active:
!jrpg@lemmy.zip
See, the 3 newest posts being 3 over a day old being considered fairly active is one of my issues with Lemmy/fediverse. My whole subscribed feed is like that. Open app, check feed that's not exclusively doom and gloom politics, and nothing has moved since I checked it the day before.
-
I've been one of the people saying "we don't need more users. we need quality over quantity" and i was wrong.
the way it's going, lemmy needs active users who post content sothat the network stays relevant. networks like the fediverse benefit from network effects and that means that if we have more users, that improves the value and quality of the fediverse overall.
So please, everyone, when you can, make advertisement for the fediverse in your personal area. Go talk to friends, make attractive stickers and put them everywhere, stuff like that. We would all benefit from it.
edit: source for the graph
I've been here a few years now and I can say Lemmy's got issues. You can't come on here and have a good time anymore when all it's about is trump trump trump and Linux Linux Linux it gets old. I wanna escape from reality a bit sometimes and there's few areas to subscribe to that gives any joy anymore.
-
Lemmy feels like a return to the old internet, when communities were smaller, and for me its refreshing to be able to participate in communities on major topics again without getting drowned out. It harkens back to the days of early forums and message boards, where users gathered around shared interests and discussions felt more organic.
I enjoy that aspect for sure. Once I had subscribed to enough communities, I have plenty of content and apparent activity in my feed. For a lot of people that takes getting used to and people have low attention spans.
-
I'm a very new user who wanted to give this a chance, here are the friction points from my point of view:
- The onboarding is way too complicated for the average user. A huge part of this is that there are 100 ways to do it. Before you even can start to do anything you have to investigate and then decide on what and how to do it. And even then there is no guidance at all, you are given options and then you can either go and do some research again or try them one by one. You lose at least 90% of the users here already. It doesn't help that fediverse users try to downplay this issue.
- Content discovery sucks ass. My feed stayed mostly the same since I started using Lemmy. I'm presented the same shit over and over again. I'm not sure if it's something that I do wrong, if there is just no content or if that's a side effect of 'no tracking at all' but either way the experience is just bad
- Someone in here already said it, but 'Lemmy' is a horrendous name. That alone was the reason why I didn't bother to try it at all for a long time. Only recent events pushed me towards it but tbh I'm not sure I'll stay.
In short the user experience is abysmal.
I agree. New user introduction is very poor. Took me ages just to choose an instance - and that was in no small part because I'm here not only to escape the enshittified chokepoint capitalism of american big tech, but also because I'm utterly sick of the domination of US centric points of view and censorship. Even though i know communities are not instance locked, I wanted an instance that is not likely to be managed in the same way. Time will tell if I chose well or poorly
-
Lemmy copying Reddit with the downvotes system is something that really frustrates me.
The downvote button is one of the most toxic things about Reddit. Nobody uses it the way it is supposedly intended to be used.
Lemmy saw that and thought great, let's copy.
I don't know whether they did it because they wanted to make a straight up Reddit clone, or whether they mistakenly thought Lemmy users would be above that kind of behaviour (lol), but either way it was a mistake IMO. It just encourages division.
Yeah I treat the downvote as a way of saying shit content or trolling or whatever. People on here seem to treat it like a disagreement button.
If you’re not engaging to try and bring people to your point of view then what are you here for cause I’m not here for a circle jerk, I can wank myself off just fine. This place seems like a club no dissimilar to r/conservative but for “our side” and fuck that I’ll hold my people to the same standards as people I don’t agree with. Thats integrity.
-
It is. It's one of the reasons i've pivot back to reddit these last few months.
-
More then Reddit this place is an echo chamber for the far left anti capitalist crowd. While I don't mind a discussion, everything over simplified to EAT THE RICH was getting tiresome.
-
No company or institution is here. If I have a problem with my [insert device or appliance here] chances are good someone on reddit will reply and 50/50 there is a useable answer somewhere. Here it just stays silent. Or you get the anti capitalist reply that everything is fucked and we should just eat the rich.
-
There are no real gaming or device or brand communities. Want to ask something about modding game x? Not here. Want to hook up with other players of game y? Not here. Want to know how to fix your [household appliance here]? Not here..Have a problem with mainboard from brand z? Not here.
-
When you ask something here about Linux or any other gpl software the answer often times boils down to RTFMI! (I= idiot) That also happens on reddit to be honest. But here it's just more extreme. And I know I'm an idiot. That's why I asked. I'm too stupid can someone please explain.
-
Where the fuck is LJDawson. Sync is dead it seems.
And yes. Reddit more and more feels like an AI test site. For example the AITA posts are getting more and more out of this world. They are unbelievable, that's just for clicks.
So the enshittification is not slowly but very fast becoming a problem and within a few months it will be another youtube, unusable. But for now... It's the best we have.For example the AITA posts are getting more and more out of this world.
What's this AITA sub you speak of?
It's called r/AmateurStoryWriters ffs, get the name right
-
-
I've been here a few years now and I can say Lemmy's got issues. You can't come on here and have a good time anymore when all it's about is trump trump trump and Linux Linux Linux it gets old. I wanna escape from reality a bit sometimes and there's few areas to subscribe to that gives any joy anymore.
Do you subscribe to other communities?
-
I'm a very new user who wanted to give this a chance, here are the friction points from my point of view:
- The onboarding is way too complicated for the average user. A huge part of this is that there are 100 ways to do it. Before you even can start to do anything you have to investigate and then decide on what and how to do it. And even then there is no guidance at all, you are given options and then you can either go and do some research again or try them one by one. You lose at least 90% of the users here already. It doesn't help that fediverse users try to downplay this issue.
- Content discovery sucks ass. My feed stayed mostly the same since I started using Lemmy. I'm presented the same shit over and over again. I'm not sure if it's something that I do wrong, if there is just no content or if that's a side effect of 'no tracking at all' but either way the experience is just bad
- Someone in here already said it, but 'Lemmy' is a horrendous name. That alone was the reason why I didn't bother to try it at all for a long time. Only recent events pushed me towards it but tbh I'm not sure I'll stay.
In short the user experience is abysmal.
Have you considered trying out Piefed? Piefed has custom feed options currently.
The onboarding is way too complicated for the average user. A huge part of this is that there are 100 ways to do it. Before you even can start to do anything you have to investigate and then decide on what and how to do it. And even then there is no guidance at all, you are given options and then you can either go and do some research again or try them one by one. You lose at least 90% of the users here already. It doesn’t help that fediverse users try to downplay this issue.
I don't really know how you make the onboarding, the instance selection easier at this point. What do you propose?
What site did you use when you found lemmy?
-
I've been one of the people saying "we don't need more users. we need quality over quantity" and i was wrong.
the way it's going, lemmy needs active users who post content sothat the network stays relevant. networks like the fediverse benefit from network effects and that means that if we have more users, that improves the value and quality of the fediverse overall.
So please, everyone, when you can, make advertisement for the fediverse in your personal area. Go talk to friends, make attractive stickers and put them everywhere, stuff like that. We would all benefit from it.
edit: source for the graph
Just wait for Reddit to finally ban porn and we’ll have more users than we know what to do with
-
Just wait for Reddit to finally ban porn and we’ll have more users than we know what to do with
you know what? that might be it!
-
too complicated
This is an Us problem. Download jerboa. Create an account on world. Done. Simple as Reddit. We make it complicated by explaining federation, options, different instances, etc. None of that matters to the masses.
I followed the directions my instance of choice had posted, also use jerboa. It was a few steps, but the directions given were simple. It didn't take me long at all to sign up.
I still don't fully understand federation, but I knew even less when I began here a few years ago. I do like using jerboa
-
Posted as a reply because this will certainly upset many but...
On the instance wars:
I constantly see nonsense about the horrors of the '.ML' instance, and 'hexbear', primarily from 'Lemmy.world' users, but I have never once actually come across these horrors.
Hexbear is just a troll instance, ala 'cumtown'.
To an outside observer, '.world' users seem to be US propagandists intent on wrecking the platform. "Tankies this, cowbee that", when I've never seen a cowbee post that wasn't entirely reasonable.
And the vast majority of 'tankies' are just people who criticise the US rightfully while not sharing the same breathe to criticize China.
Ngl, fuck Russia, the US and Russia are the greatest evils. China is not anywhere near the same level. You can praise elements of a foreign state without being a 'tankie'.It's the same thought terminating cliche cult bullshit that all right wingers do. And it seems to come from Americans being upset their myopic views aren't babied by people who literally specifically went to an instance to avoid them?
Idk I'm not a user of any of the three, but I've only ever had an issue with lemmy.world users in the past, as a UK citizen who is far from a tankie.
Well, you wouldn't come across hexbear or lemmygrad on pawb.social because it looks like your instance is defederated from them.
To an outside observer, ‘.world’ users seem to be US propagandists intent on wrecking the platform. “Tankies this, cowbee that”, when I’ve never seen a cowbee post that wasn’t entirely reasonable.
Cowbee definitely seems in a sense like a very civil apologist (although with all the trappings of contemporary campism and tankiesm) - and not the worst example by any means, but for every Cowbee there's a BrainInABox type user.
-
i find out alot of people i blocked are the likely posters, yea thats probably why im seeing less and less posts now.
I'm not talking about people I block (I am not exposed enough and don't suffer enough harassment so I don't block almost anyone)... I'm talking about about mods of the instancr that hosts people I care about suddenly blocking instance that hosts my account - not because anything we did but because they didn't like that mods of my instance didn't block another instance that has some weird (e.g. transfobic) content. I follow a friend and suddenly we are out of contact because some entirely unrelated drama. And that's how fediverse works by design.
-
Posted as a reply because this will certainly upset many but...
On the instance wars:
I constantly see nonsense about the horrors of the '.ML' instance, and 'hexbear', primarily from 'Lemmy.world' users, but I have never once actually come across these horrors.
Hexbear is just a troll instance, ala 'cumtown'.
To an outside observer, '.world' users seem to be US propagandists intent on wrecking the platform. "Tankies this, cowbee that", when I've never seen a cowbee post that wasn't entirely reasonable.
And the vast majority of 'tankies' are just people who criticise the US rightfully while not sharing the same breathe to criticize China.
Ngl, fuck Russia, the US and Russia are the greatest evils. China is not anywhere near the same level. You can praise elements of a foreign state without being a 'tankie'.It's the same thought terminating cliche cult bullshit that all right wingers do. And it seems to come from Americans being upset their myopic views aren't babied by people who literally specifically went to an instance to avoid them?
Idk I'm not a user of any of the three, but I've only ever had an issue with lemmy.world users in the past, as a UK citizen who is far from a tankie.
The reason why you haven't seen these horrors is because to you they just look like others like you.
Regardless if you agree with this post, for example, it's propaganda, no different than the american apologists you can accurately identify, the bible thumpling catholics educating the uncivilized people that hadn't heard the healing words of our lord and saviour jesus christ or those who believe everything should be privatized/converted into a free market due to orthodox economic doctrine.
It is propaganda because it operates under the framework that someone who disagrees with a positive association must have not understood a specific sacred text or heard a sacred doctrine, or if they have they must be morally defficient, leaving no room for debate whatsoever.
It's extremely difficult to identify propaganda that caters to our own emotional needs and positive associations.
One of the easiest ways to spot propaganda is the "no room for questioning, let alone disagreeing" aspect. In healthy societies with healthy ideologies there is a legitimate space for disagreement and debate. If there wasn't, power would always remain in the same hands which is one of the aspects most criticize about both capitalism and communism.
And believe it or not, there is more to the world than the right-left west-east dychotomies.
If you look at history, similar ideologigal schisms have happened time and time again in times of shifts in the balance of power, such as when the printing press was invented and the the catholic - lutheran division that came from it. or during the decadence and later fall of the roman republic with the equestrials vs patricians (which originally shared ideological vision).
These largescale violent power struggles always end up boiling down to "you're either with us or against us" which in my opinion is the true poison.
Feel free to disqualify or label me now and have a nice day.
-
I've been one of the people saying "we don't need more users. we need quality over quantity" and i was wrong.
the way it's going, lemmy needs active users who post content sothat the network stays relevant. networks like the fediverse benefit from network effects and that means that if we have more users, that improves the value and quality of the fediverse overall.
So please, everyone, when you can, make advertisement for the fediverse in your personal area. Go talk to friends, make attractive stickers and put them everywhere, stuff like that. We would all benefit from it.
edit: source for the graph
Look, this is my filter list:
Because i don't want to deal with depressing politics every day in my off time.
And this is what i still see:
Maybe a tagging system would help?
-
Let's stop working on "Lemmy app" , "mbin app", "PieFed app", "Mastodon app" and just embrace ActivityPub as the single API.
phone apps can't use activity pub as that's a server protocol so if you want a good mobile interface you generally speaking need a rest-y api that an application can query. yes, lemmy and piefed both feature PWA frontends that can be installed to your homescreen, however on older phones this can be an extremely suboptimal experience as PWAs tend to require more RAM than native apps.
-
Look, this is my filter list:
Because i don't want to deal with depressing politics every day in my off time.
And this is what i still see:
Maybe a tagging system would help?
Piefed has built in keyword filters for posts. You can move to piefed.zip if you want more options here.
![Cowbee [he/they]](https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/c18ce632-5fb5-4888-8226-3dc55a07acc4.jpeg "Cowbee [he/they]"){kind=avatar}
